Smithers MINNEAPOLIS

I, for one, am not a Floyd fan and thought it kind of funny that people were waiting in line to get his autograph/picture during the NVGP……uh…no thanks. I’m sure there is some talent there, but meh-there were plenty of local riders who probably deserve more support.

There are fine riders in the domestic pro peloton, but it’s hard for the favorites to be as interesting as Flandis when they are mostly noteworthy for being a ProTour rider’s little brother or having led/won the very same race in past editions. I can’t really fault anyone for being just a little star-struck.

He answers his own question: I haven no personal views on Floyd Landis’s guilt. I love the him. I’ve know him from way back in MTB racing. He is a super nice guy.
Seems simple enough to me; what’s not to understand?

There’s a difference between “sporting popularity” and “carnival sideshow curiosity”. For me, Froid Flandis falls into the latter.

I am not a fan of Floyd; Apples can confirm this no problem. For better or for worse, I chose not to clap or cheer for him when he broke away during the Stillwater crit.

I, too, dislike what I perceive to be an arrogant attitude. I agree with meow’s “meh” assessment.

Oh how the mighty have fallen. 3 yrs ago Landis would have ripped the legs off everyone and won the NVGP by a couple minutes. Now he’s riding for a team named Ouch. If thats not karma… I dont know what karma is. By the way, people were clapping for Landis-and the local amatuers-because they were the only riders they recognized.

Let’s not forget how much $$$ he scammed from his sponsors to fund his defense. No remorse. And now he is essentially pack fill in the domestic peloton. I have 10x more respect for Kohl.

call Mr. Friendly, but I’m not bugged with Landis and did cheer him on @ stillwater.

He served his time. guilty or not, who cares… he’s just trying to make a living at what he does best, probably at a percentage of what he used to make.

let him race, cheer him on… cheer them all on if they are nice, thats what I say…
mr Friendly Peter Anderson

Doping is an emotional topic. Don’t expect rational behavior.

With respect to not riding like the Flandis of old, that’s due to the hip replacement.

And he’s the 2nd rider to have a Tour title stripped. Maurice Garin was the first.

Sounds like one Steve Tilford is jealous.

Much has been made of Flandis being the first TDF winner to be stripped. This argument really loses its punch when you look more into the history of doping in the TDF. Bernard Thevenet narrowly escaped getting nabbed in his 1977 win for instance. Just maybe he had some friends in the right places. From http://www.abcc.co.uk/Articles/DrgsTdeF.html

“The 1977 Tour ended in confusion, depression and suspicion: Joop Zoetemelk gave a sample at L’Alpe d’Huez and his positive was announced after the penultimate stage at Versailles. He was penalised and at once a row erupted, led by Raphael Géminiani. ‘If the rules are to be enforced, let them apply to everyone,’ he shouted. Henry Anglade suggested sarcastically that Van Impe, currently third, might not after all have lost the Tour just yet, implying that both race leader Bernard Thévenet and second-placed Kuiper were culpable. People circulated secret lists of those suspected. Two hundred disillusioned journalists waited for an official statement, which finally declared Thévenet the winner. Some months later, during the winter of 1978, Thévenet admitted that he had used cortisone. He would never again figure among the leaders of the Tour.”

I’m not defending Landis here. He got nabbed for something. Maybe we’ll know the complete truth someday. In the greater scheme of things Landis isn’t so different than a lot of riders in the past or present. I’m sure there’s more to the story that we all don’t know.

I’m a cycling fan. I want to see cheaters get caught. But, I don’t really KNOW these people at all, and thus it seems a bit much to actually love/hate these people.

I’ve heard Steve speak on this very topic. He is not jealous, just frustrated, as any of us would be when cheated (literally) out of results, sponsorships, and therefore a better living. I know that Steve accepts that this sport has its cheats, doesn’t mean he has to like it or shut up or quit racing clean.

As for Mr. Testosterone, how anyone would want his signature now is beyond me. It is not so much that he doped, it is the the repugnant shameful way he carried out his defense. Having your manager threaten Greg Lemond with a personal secret told in order to help you but in strict confidence? That is just despicable, regardless of what you think of Lemond. The black tie he wore to court that day said it all, the man has no honor left. Personally, I can not even look at his picture in the cycling press much less cheer him. He deserves a harsher punishment from cycling fans than he got from USADA, lifetime ban.

Checkbook is correct. He’s not a fan of Floyd. I’ll say myself that Landis has far from elevated the sport with his actions, and that is sad. He had the opportunity to take responsibility, but he chose aggressive denial. I respectfully disagree with Bob that Floyd is riding worse now because of the hip replacement. He crashed on it in a MTB race and it was fine, and he himself has said it doesn’t affect his performance. Floyd got lapped in the Stillwater Crit because he’s clean now.

Back to the point I originally wanted to make: I get more inspiration from local boy Adam Bergman and the progress he has made in the past few years. He has taken a mature, humble approach to his comeback. He realizes the rest of the world is bigger than him!

“I respectfully disagree with Bob that Floyd is riding worse now because of the hip replacement. He crashed on it in a MTB race and it was fine, and he himself has said it doesn’t affect his performance. Floyd got lapped in the Stillwater Crit because he’s clean now.”

Two points:

- Didn’t work that way for Bo Jackson.
- You don’t know he’s clean. Lots of guys dope and still suck.

Lets be brutally frank here. One of the issues is that people don’t care. Lots of people say they do, but when the rubber meets the road, they don’t.

Here’s an example. Ask people what would be an appropriate response to strong circumstantial evidence that high school athletes were doping. Kids. Not adults, kids. I bet most people would advocate for some pretty aggressive measures.

A number of years ago (2001 I think) I remember reading a story in the Strib about how All-Metro linemen had gotten way bigger in a short period of time. The author had checked stats and discovered a 50 lb increase in about 10 years. 50 lbs. I think everyone here can read between the lines of that story.

Remember, we’re not talking adults, we’re talking about kids and a career path that may pay for college but is almost certainly a dead end beyond that.

But no one cares. No one.

I care about doping when I get on the highway. Someone with a head full of shit could kill me or a member of my family. If you want me to get wound up about doping, that’s where I can get wound up about doping. I could get wound up about doping in high school athletes, but not by myself. Not if one one else cares. And no one cares.

When it comes to doping in sport, nothing beats the Olympics. You guys all groove on the Olympics, don’t you. No one cares about the dope, and the fact that no one cares about it is what allows sponsors to pump in the massive amounts of money that drives the doping.

Sorry, I can’t get wound up about doping in something I view as entertainment. My outrage peters out way before then. No one cares, including the people that insist they do.

@Apples: go bergman!

@Apples: What was your opinion on Dewey’s comeback. From what I’ve seen people were a lot faster to welcome Adam back into the peleton than Dewey.

@ringcycles: So, we’ve all been shit-hooked by Tilford in a race – many times – can we be frustrated with that sort of behavior as well?

Cheaters are cheaters, the method is immaterial.

Nice Buckeye, so true.

@concerned: I, for one, am guilty of having expressed negativity toward Dewey, at times in poor taste. I did so without knowing much about Dewey or his situation and I now regret both. I also don’t know much about the similarities or lack thereof in “reintegration” of either Dewey or Bergman.

In any event, I can’t hate on a guy who had a humble response to defeat at the hands of Pat at the state cross race last Fall — I think Smithers put it best calling it classy.

People, like opinions, change all the time. Hopefully, more of them move in a positive direction than in reverse. My opinion of Landis remains the same, however.

In my eyes Landis is a shell of a man.